Interview with Pete Wargent: Part One – Financially Free at 33

Pete WargentPete Wargent wears an impressive number of different hats.  Top-selling author.  Market analyst and economic expert.  Property buyers agent.  Personal coach.  And blogger!

But there’s another notch in Pete’s belt that readers might not be aware of.  He’s one of the earliest published examples of an Aussie reaching Financial Independence at a young age!  (well, he’s originally from the UK, but that’s okay) 😉

I’ve followed Pete since the very beginning back in 2012, through his daily blog and various books.  In fact, I very much looked at Pete as a role model during my own journey to Financial Independence (and still do today).

So it’s with great pleasure I bring you a two-part interview with Pete.  Part One is about his journey, investing experience and how he now enjoys spending his time, after reaching FI at age 33.  And in Part Two, we’ll get Pete’s insights into the future of the Australian economy and long term investing.

Lots to cover, so let’s get started!

 

Introduction to Financial Independence & Investing

Dave:  When did you first discover the concept of Financial Independence?  Or when did you decide the traditional lifelong career thing was not for you?

Pete Wargent:  Good question.  I don’t believe I thought it was a realistic goal until I was in my mid-twenties.  At least, not for me.

But I guess as an accountant I saw that some of my clients had achieved huge things, so that planted the seed with me.  And then when I began investing in earnest jointly with my then girlfriend (now wife), I realised that there was potential to get there.

 

Dave:  Was your wife completely on board from day one?  Or was there some debate around it?

Pete Wargent:  100%.  In fact, when we first met that was a wake-up call for me, because she was absolutely miles ahead of me.  She has a couple of years on me age-wise and bought her first house in Cambridge (near London) at 21.  And when we met she had already paid down a huge chunk of the mortgage, plus she had already been averaging into a couple of index funds for years.  And I was nowhere by comparison.

I think we helped each other: in some ways I was more self-confident, while she was more established, and had a more senior role at work.  We were both higher rate taxpayers by the age of about 25 (her) and 26 (me), so that helped quite a lot, obviously.

 

The Road to Financial Independence

Dave:  Can you share what your journey to FI looked like?  

Pete Wargent:  That’s where it started for me.  Initially I was most interested in the stock market and fundamental analysis, because my job involved auditing listed company financials, and then later when I became a Group Financial Controller preparing listed company financials and ASX releases.  So I felt that I should be best suited to a value style of investing.

In time, however, I learned that you can spend an awful lot of time analysing companies and still get it wrong.  And also, it is a bit trickier to time the market than it first appears – bull and bear markets can run for much longer than you might think, and the market can also tread water for years.  So I moved towards a much more diversified approach in time, to let the wider market and dividend growth do the heavy lifting with more peace of mind.

When I was 28 I realised that if we were going to get out of the rat race sooner rather than later we were going to need to use more leverage (not just margin loans and CFDs – which I did use a lot – but also more mortgage debt).  So we went pretty hard into real estate in Sydney with 3 properties there, as well as properties in London, and Essex in the UK, to add to the house in Cambridge.

All those markets have basically exploded, and that was where we got the bulk of our results in the first ten years, with our first six properties performing hugely.  I’m not saying it’s right for everyone to use so much leverage, but that was our journey and our experience.

The stock market performed just fine and has kept ticking along ever since.  But it’s been a steadier journey for us, as we missed the US stock market boom, being mainly invested in UK index funds.

 

Dave:  How long did it take you to reach FI, after you started working towards this goal?  

Pete Wargent:  I was 33 when I quit my full-time job, and I suppose it was a lifelong journey.  But as alluded to above, most of the big spike in results really came in the five or so years leading up to that point, and then over the years that followed too.

 

Dave:  What were your work roles along the way?  And did you enjoy the work?

Pete Wargent:  I was a Chartered Accountant in London, and then later in Sydney.  It’s a tough qualification with years of exams and three years of experience to become time qualified.  Both my wife and I were ultimately Directors at Deloitte, which is one of the big 4 accountancy firms.  I enjoyed some of the work, and it was great having a ‘year group’ of mates to move through the system with.

But it could also be quite stressful, and the hours were long, while the regulation and compliance are heavy going these days.  I probably enjoyed 80% of it, and there was some great fun along the way.  But I found some of the meetings very dull, and having to be in one place for days on end didn’t suit someone like me at all.

A bit like most things in life, it wasn’t all good or all bad.  I liked the actual work.  I didn’t like the office politics all that much.

 

Saving and Investing

Dave:  Do you remember your savings rate (how much of your incomes you were saving)?  And did your attitude towards spending change once you had something to work towards?

Pete Wargent:  Not much to start with.  But then it was massive for a few years, when we decided to target financial independence.  Compared to our peers, I mean, really huge.  We stopped going out completely and trained for the Sydney Marathon for 6 months, and that period was almost a total spending freeze!

We were never too obsessive about it.  But towards the end of our full time work we made a very conscious effort to save as much as possible.

I was a bit resentful some of the time, when I’d rather have been out on Friday and Saturday nights, and it was a big lifestyle change for us.  I found it hard initially, and I started going straight to the gym after work on Friday nights for a couple of hours.  That was the toughest time of the week – at the end of the fifth day of work – not to go out to the pub.  

But I figured that it would benefit us in the long run.  And we saved the deposit to buy two properties in Sydney, largely by foregoing expensive forms of socialising for quite a long time.

 

Dave:  Can you share what your investment strategy was from the start?  And has it changed at all over the years?

Pete Wargent:  It’s been varied.  At the beginning there was more value investing in individual companies and share trading, including with margin loans, options, and other leverage.  Throughout the entire period we’ve dollar cost averaged into the FTSE index, which we’re still doing even today.

And the property strategy we’ve used has just been to buy, renovate, and hold property in the biggest capital cities we could afford at any given point in time.  And we’ve never sold a property ever since the first one Heather bought all the way back in the in mid-1990s.  

 

Dave:  What does your portfolio look like today?  And what are your investment plans for the future?

Pete Wargent:  Our goal when we started out was to own ten properties in ten years, evenly split between Australia and the UK.  Because we wanted to focus on quality rather than quantity, it took us a bit longer than ten years, but we got there in the end.

We’ll still add some more properties opportunistically over time – and we do plan to build on some land that we have at some point – but we don’t use much leverage these days.  The last two UK properties we bought for cash, so they pay us income.  And the last property we bought in Australia was in New Farm in Brisbane, which was a renovation project.

The shares are much simpler these days.  We invest in a couple of different UK index tracker funds, and a few LICs in Australia.  Not many individual stocks at all, just the odd one when it takes our fancy.  So I bought Commonwealth Bank in the mid $60s during the Royal Commission.  But mostly its ultra-low-cost funds and LICs when we have spare cash.

 

Dave:  You hold shares and property in both Australia and the UK.  Do you feel international diversification is a must?  Or does it just suit your circumstances because of your UK background?

Pete Wargent:  The latter for us.  But I don’t know if that’s essential for most people.  I really like Aussie shares because the dividend yields can be double the MSCI global average, and the tax benefits are comparatively attractive.  But if someone said they wanted to get exposure to international shares too for the diversification, I’d find it hard to disagree with them.  It’s horses for courses.

 

Portfolio Allocation

Dave:  Do you target an allocation between asset classes and countries?  Or do you simply invest where you see attractive opportunities at the time?

Pete Wargent:  Ideally it would be great to have a balance of everything split across countries.  But for us there’s been a bit of following the opportunities as well.  So we don’t obsess over it.  For me, I just want to keep moving forward in whichever way seems best at the time.

 

Dave:  So the essence of your strategy is investing in prime location property for capital growth and diversified shares like LICs and index funds for growing income, is that correct?  And what has influenced your thinking on this?

Pete Wargent:  Absolutely.  People seem to become quite tribal on the property or shares debate.  But I think there are advantages to both, provided you are sensible. 

If you want to use leverage and find opportunities to add value, then property can do that for you.  But if you want passive income, shares are far more efficient, with far fewer headaches.

If someone says to me they just want to do shares and never own a rental and that’s good for them, then I wouldn’t disagree.  Whatever works best for you.

What’s influenced my thinking?  I hate the idea of paying CGT (Capital Gains Tax).  And I’m an accountant, so my spreadsheets told me to buy good quality assets that you never have to sell.

 

Dave:  Do you think it’s better to hold both property and shares in an investment portfolio?  Or should it be tailored to one’s own goals and which asset class appeals to them?  

Pete Wargent:  I personally do, because all asset classes have summer and winter seasons.  During the Sydney or London property booms I’d have hated to be not owning any property at all, because I was in a hurry to get to my financial goals.  But some people are more patient and have a nailed-on preference for the stock market, and that’s fine too.  

 

Dave:  Do you add to your portfolio on a regular basis whenever you can afford to, or wait for opportunities?  Or do you approach each asset class differently in this regard?

Pete Wargent:  Whenever we can afford to.  It’s never the perfect time to buy, so we tend to just get on with it and take the best opportunities on offer at the time.  And that’s the case for shares or property.

 

Life Lessons

Dave:  If you were starting from scratch today, what would you do differently?  This can be in terms of your finances, lifestyle, investment strategy – anything really!

Pete Wargent:  Wow, that is a really good question.

Honest answer?  I would stop partying earlier, and invest more sooner.  Both financially and in myself (in terms of learning life and business skills).  The single biggest hurdle for me was boozing (and smoking), which I did way too much of in my teens and early twenties.  Once I quit all that, I moved forward at lightning speed, and ideally I should’ve done it sooner.  But I look forward, not back!

Interestingly, I do plenty of personal coaching with my business Next Level Wealth these days, and one thing that invariably comes up with my clients is a regret of some sort.  A stock or property they should or shouldn’t have bought, or a business that didn’t work out as hoped.

But hindsight is 20/20 and if life was easy we’d all be heroes.  So all you can do is take the lessons from the mistakes and resolve to look forward, not back.

In terms of investing, I think we’ve been quite lucky and ridden some massive bull markets.  So while I could always say that I’d have done something or other sooner or better, I’m not going to complain.

 

Dave:  Did you struggle with anything along the way?  For example, peer pressure, self-doubt or patience?

Pete Wargent:  Partying and the peer pressure to join in with it when I was younger.  It’s very hard to save when you eat out at hotels and restaurants, and go to the pub regularly.

Peer pressure was also hard when I went out on my own to write books and start a business.  And there was a level of negativity from some friends and associates.  It doesn’t bother me now, but it did for a while.

My advice to anyone in the same boat: don’t be that person that doesn’t go for it because you’re worried about what friends might say.  It’s not their fault – they only know you as the old you.  And they probably aren’t your target audience, so just take a deep breath go for it.

And anxiety.  I had a chronic anxiety disorder when I was younger.  In hindsight it’s easy to see why – I had a change of country to Australia, I moved to a new house, had a change of girlfriend, change of job, change of career.

There was an awful lot of disruption in my life in a short space of time.  But I didn’t get that at the time and thought I should cope with it all easily.  Burning the candle at both ends – ‘work hard, play hard’ – certainly didn’t help.

 

Escaping the Rat Race

Dave:  When you left work, was your portfolio income paying the bills?  Or did you just take the leap once you reached a certain net worth?  And if you’re okay sharing, what was that net worth roughly?

Pete Wargent:  Not at that time.  Our combined net worth was about $3 million Aussie (if you’re reading this in the future that felt like a huge sum at the time, though today it wouldn’t go as far). 

The thought process was to assume a comfortable 5% potential income return on equity, so a $150,000 passive income would require about $3 million of equity.  But we still had some real estate costs, so, no, it wasn’t all about passive income for us at that time.

 

Dave:  Did you always plan to get into business and/or write books?  Or did you quit work with no plan but to simply follow your interests?

Pete Wargent:  Not at all!  We went travelling for 15 months, and I just decided to write a book after a few weeks of travelling, when I was at a loose end.  And it all just kind of led on from there.

When I quit my role as Group Financial Controller I had absolutely no idea where life would take us.  We drove the ‘Big Lap’ of Australia in a camper van, lived in Darwin for a bit, and then East Timor.  And then went on a world cruise for a few months.

We just thought we’d let life take us wherever.  It was brilliant, actually.  Sounds very idyllic to me now that we have two kids!  I doubt I’d have done many things that I have if we hadn’t taken the plunge to go travelling, so I’m very glad we did.

 

Dave:  After reaching FI, I understand you now spend quite a bit of time in the UK, to see family and sometimes work.  Was that always the idea?  

Pete Wargent:  Yes that was a big driver for us.  The ultimate goal for us was to spend 6 months of the year here in Queensland, and 6 months in England.  It’s never quite worked out like that, and for the past decade the split has tended to be more like 7-8 months in Australia, and the rest overseas in the Old Dart.

We’re not always in Britain for the summer time, which hasn’t been quite what we planned…but that’s life.

 

New Challenges

Dave:  Can you tell us about the work you do now?  And what made you want to dive in and become a business owner?

Pete Wargent:  I have a property buying business, and I do personal and business coaching.  Originally our property work was in London, which was mainly for businesses and funds, but now we’re mainly active in Australia and buy for individuals.

And then I also have an advisory business for fund managers and hedge funds.  But when I say ‘business’, that’s really just me that does that.  Some of it is selling reports, some is conference calls to groups of, say, a dozen fund managers, and some of it is on a consulting basis.  But it’s just me, so it’s not really a business, per se.

In terms of why to start out with all that – I’m quite ambitious, and I found when travelling that I got quite agitated about having no purpose to my day.  And I was doing all the reading and research anyway. Perhaps like a lot of blokes, I’m not very good at relaxing.  I almost never take a full day off, even when we go on holiday.  I just love working for myself.

 

Dave:  Do you think it makes more sense to wait until you’re financially independent before starting your own business? 

Pete Wargent:  For me, yes, because I don’t think I’m really a natural entrepreneur.  Or I certainly wasn’t when I was younger, as I lacked knowledge and confidence.  But I have friends that have been self-employed or business owners since the age of 21, so it takes all sorts.

 

Dave:  Has anything surprised you about life after reaching FI?

Pete Wargent:  Definitely!  When I was 23 or 24 and stressed out in the early part of my career, I literally day-dreamed about not having to work. 

I couldn’t imagine anything better than not having to go into the office.  I had this fantasy of having a home with a great lawn, and how I’d just spend the day mowing the lawn and chilling out in the sun.  And I’d have given almost anything at that time to be in the position I am today.

But now I could easily spend my days mowing the lawn, and I’ve learned that the grass is not always greener on the other side…literally so, in this case.  Now I’d find it pretty difficult not to work.

So I’ve learned that your problems never go away, as such, you just get a new set of challenges.

 

Dave:  What’s the best part of Financial Independence?

Pete Wargent:  The confidence to follow my passion without having to worry about idiot bosses.  I absolutely love waking up in Noosa and ripping into the day with a run at the beach with some music on my i-Pod, and then a swim.

You couldn’t pay me a million bucks to go back and work full time in professional practice.  Or two million.  No chance!

 

Dave:  What’s not so good?  Anything?

Pete Wargent:  Sometimes I miss office banter a little bit when I work from home.  I’m taking on board a new guy on 1 July, and he’s a really good lad.  So I’m looking forward to sharing a bit more fun and working together with him.

Working as I do on my own sometimes can get a little bit lonely.  But it’s a minor gripe compared to working with some of the people I had to in my full-time career.  You can’t choose your family or work colleagues as they say!

 

Dave:  How do you most enjoy spending your time these days?  What balance between free time, family and work feels right for you?

Pete Wargent:  We have two kids now.  When they are at pre-school or school, I go the beach twice per day for a walk or run, plus have a coffee, and work the rest of the time.  And spend some time with my wife, of course.

When they aren’t at school, we go to spend time at the Buderim Ginger Factory at Yandina (the kids’ favourite place, and I love having a coffee there too), or to Mooloolaba Aquarium and beach.  Or we go to Australia Zoo at Beerwah, where we have annual membership.

I’m a massive convert to Noosa and the Sunshine Coast lifestyle and have no interest in moving back to Sydney any time soon.

 

Other Thoughts

Dave:  What do you think helped you the most in terms of reaching FI? Leverage?  High incomes?  Strong savings habit?

Pete Wargent:  All of those.  But for us it was two good salaries (with bonuses), plus saving and investing hard with leverage.  I know some people don’t like the idea, but nevertheless it’s true we could never have achieved the same results without the leverage.

 

Dave:  You’ve often advocated renting rather than owning a home earlier in life, in order to save more and build investments faster.  Is that still the case?  And I understand now you own your home – was that choice essentially because it has no effect on your freedom these days, having built further wealth and income streams?

Pete Wargent:  That’s almost correct.  What happened was a house was passed down from a deceased family member a few years ago.  So that was renovated a couple of years back and we live in that courtesy of the enormous generosity of my in-laws. 

This might make it sound like we’re from a trust fund baby background – but really it’s nothing like that, just a modest 4-bedroom house, on a quarter-acre block.  Though we do have a very nice lawn, actually.

On ‘rent-vesting’: this can certainly make sense because it’s cheaper than ownership from a cashflow perspective, and because young people can tend to move around much more than previous generations. But it only works if you do save the difference and invest it!  It’s no good if you spend everything you earn…then you’d be better off owning, to be honest.

 

Dave:  What’s your chosen approach to living off a portfolio?  Purely rent and dividend income steams?

Pete Wargent:  Bit of both.  We still buy properties.  Although the last couple have been cash purchases that generate a nice rental income cashflow.  So our portfolio LVR has been falling away quite rapidly to about 30 per cent.  And we still buy shares.  I see the end game as being mainly Australian equities, but in saying that we’re still accumulating on all fronts for now.

 

Words of Advice

Dave:  What do you see as the main hurdles or financial traps for the average Aussie in terms of being able to reach financial independence?

Pete Wargent:  Consumer debt and spending all they earn.  It’s Parkinson’s Law #2 (spending expands to meet income).  And the consumer economy demands a certain lifestyle, or at least the perception of one.

 

Dave:  Any last words of advice for readers who are on the journey right now, from what you’ve learned along the way?

Pete Wargent:  It takes courage to tread your own path.  But if it’s right for you, go for it with everything you’ve got, and never give up.  Learn about the ‘hedgehog concept’ of how to choose how to earn a living.  I reckon life’s too short to do something you don’t enjoy for too long.

 

Dave:  You have a new book aimed at young people and financial education, called ‘Wealth Ways for the Young’ .  As a brief message on the topic, what do you think are the key lessons we can convey to young people to get them thinking about their future earlier, and possibly even motivated to build their own financial independence?

Pete Wargent:  Definitely start instilling good financial habits at a young age.  In fact, in the first chapter of my new book I listed the 20 simple things that young people need to do.  And they are simple steps.

Not taking on credit cards and consumer debt is key.  Use cash to pay for stuff.  Learn to cook.  Get a part time job at a young age.  Spend less than you earn.  Get an ultra-low-cost, and high growth super fund, with a proven track record.

It’s mainly very simple stuff.

The motivation part is different for different people.  But the programming is built in from a young age, so instilling good financial habits as early as possible is important.

 

My Thoughts

Well, I hope you enjoyed Part One!

It’s certainly great to hear about Pete’s journey, life lessons and investments in a little more detail.  As I said, I’ve been a fan of his for a long time and have gained huge value from his writings.

There’s no doubt, he’s become a perpetual high achiever, and he loves it that way!  But I found it fascinating that, like me, he fantasized about doing nothing after reaching FI.  Only to later realise, it’s important to have something meaningful to work on each day to give you a sense of purpose.

The great part about FI is, the ‘work’ can be anything you want – tailored to your interests, skills, personality, and amount of time you want to spend on it.

If you have any comments or questions about Pete’s journey, drop them in the comments section below.  With any luck, he might even pop by to answer a couple…

Next up, we’ll do a deep dive into the Australian economy and what the future looks like for Aussie investors.  Pete will share his view on all the big issues.  Household debt.  Recessions.  Asia.  Population growth.  And many other things, including the sharemarket and real estate.  Stay tuned!

In the meantime, check out his daily blog here (a must read for economic news), and you can also contact Pete through his personal website or his coaching website.

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31 comments

  1. Thanks Dave and Pete for taking the time to put this interview together. Good list of questions you asked also and looking forward to part 2. I’ve enjoyed reading Pete’s thoughts and his book over the years. I find it interesting because as he puts it he does not become “tribal” and wedded to one side in the property or shares debate.

    I found it interesting how he really ramped up his saving later on in his financial independence journey. Going to the gym on Friday nights and cutting back on dining out. Although he did say he was never obsessive about it.

    Seeing as though he and his wife were earning good money with their salaries and hit a very good net worth figure at 33 years of age, I am wondering how he looks back on that period now. I understand how he doesn’t regret say the boozing or smoking. But in hindsight could he have say, maybe socialised more at the pub without getting drunk (I hope to give that a try one day in my life myself!) , dined out here and there a bit more and loosened the purse strings a little? I wonder that because his knowledge has enabled him to still generate plenty of income from other business ventures he enjoys today. So I am thinking even if the net worth figure was a heap less when he was 33 life could have still worked out roughly the same?
    Or perhaps that is not the case? Maybe the ramp up in saving was crucial to getting together more deposits on property, and with the leverage enabled him to hit that high net worth figure at 33.

    1. Thanks Steve, glad you enjoyed it! His analysis is always well balanced and rational – something which is increasingly rare these days.

      Interesting questions mate. Given Pete’s drive and skillset I also think he would’ve been perfectly fine spending more and leaving work with far less net worth. But easy to say looking back I guess. Maybe Pete can comment on that…

  2. Hi Dave,

    Great interview. Like you, I have been following Pete for a long time as well and have read most of his books. He reminds me of you; humble, young achiever and and does not seem to take himself too seriously.

    I know Pete grew up playing club cricket with Alistair Cook, the former England cricket captain. I have been a massive admirer of Cook (in spite of him scoring a century on debut against my team and beating them at a home series (hurts!).

    I am curious to know if Pete has a view on how or why Cook had such a driven, yet down to earth personality from such a young age and if he has had a chance to catch up with Cook over the years to share/glean life lessons.

    Thanks again for all the great content on here and the forums.

    1. Cheers Orangestreet, that’s very kind of you to say 🙂

      Perhaps Pete will pop by to share a view on that…

      Thanks for reading!

      1. Hi guys,

        I’ve asked myself the same question, as I had lofty ambitions in the cricket world, but was never remotely good enough to play at a higher level.

        Obviously a certain level of natural talent is a big part of it, but as far as I could tell the difference with Cooky was an unshakeable self-belief.

        He was exactly the same all the way through from juniors cricket to facing McGrath & Warne at Test level, he could just be level-headed whether he scored a duck or a century and look forward to the next ball.

        He never let the highs go to his head, or got too down about the low days, even when the media was crucifying England at home.

        And the same applied whether they won the Ashes a couple of times or when they got drubbed, he just retained a similar temperament.

        Most people let successes go to their heads & become depressed by failures, certainly in cricket, and probably in life too.

        But even still, 10,000 Test runs…! An amazing achievement, and still a down-to-earth nice guy after all that, which I guess must be pretty rare!

        Cheers,

        Pete

  3. Brilliantly done Dave, it was a great read.

    I’ve not heard of Pete before, but after this interview he’s earned my respect. I particularly liked his balanced approach in using both shares and property to grow his networth.

    Looking forward to part 2!

  4. Wow – 2 FI legends in the one blog!

    I found it hard to process such awesomeness. Have a feeling I will revisit this blog again and again.

    Did you guys meet through Michael Yardney by any chance?

    1. Haha that’s pretty generous Craig, but thanks!!

      While we both know Michael Yardney, we didn’t meet through him. I found Pete through his blog and books 🙂

  5. Hey SMA, really enjoyed that interview.
    Helps motivation when you hear about other success stories. I hadn’t heard of Pete before but will check out his books /links.
    Sounds like he has a great lifestyle with a good balance of beach/fitness, work and family.
    No sign of lean fire there.
    Great questions also, well done.

    Looking forward to part 2. 🙂

    1. Cheers PR!

      We don’t have as many young FI success stories as the US does, but it’s growing and Pete is definitely worth listening to. Yep it certainly seems like he’s living the life he really wants 🙂

  6. How does he get 150k passive income? Does he redraw equity every year? Doesnt he have to pay interest on that (equity release loan?)

    1. Thanks for the question Sara. Pete isn’t using the portfolio to live off right now. The scenario was simply that they quit work with a net worth of $3m, which would’ve been enough to create a very solid passive income stream, but since leaving work he’s been doing other stuff that he enjoys and earning an income doing that. That’s my understanding.

      1. I’ve never been a fan of the ‘living off equity’ idea…at some point the banks are going to say ‘nuh uh’ (they pulled up the ladder in Britain years ago!).

        It’s not a bad idea to take the principal of growing equity, but just borrowing forever and piling up debt as advocated in some books, well, that’s not for me.

  7. Read all his books and pop into his website mostly every day. Very real and grounded Guys is Pete.
    Now all I have to do is step away from my fears and do that thing that’s burning inside me.

    Really enjoyed this transcript and looking forward to the next one Dave.

    1. Thanks Phil 🙂

      Great to hear you’re also a fan of Pete’s and enjoyed the interview. Part Two is set to be fantastic, in my biased opinion!

  8. Thanks Dave!
    I’ve been following Pete’s posts ever since I read a couple of his books, the first one of which you recommended. I really enjoy Pete’s positivity and frankness often delivered in a British expression I haven’t heard before.
    I struggled a bit with the “anti-social” aspect of avoiding partying with mates initially. Although we are all a bit frugal so most of us would rather hang back at home and have a good time with home brew.
    Cheers

    1. Good to have like-minded friends like that Mateo!

      I enjoy the British expression, which sometimes reminds me of Peter Thornhill. Pete’s commentary/analysis is always thoughtful and full of common sense, unlike the vast majority of financial news/writing out there! Thanks for reading mate.

  9. Great interview. It’ s interesting to note that the default assumption when someone says they invest in property is that it’s residential. Does Pete own any commercial properties? What’s his view on commercial properties?

    1. Cheers Aleks 🙂
      That’s a fair point to make, it’s just overwhelmingly more common for people to buy residential property I think. I’d also like to know his view on commercial property and/or REITs.

      1. Hi Aleck, we do have some property that isn’t resi, but it’s totally ungeared. I’m not convinced it’s the best idea for most people, though, as there are so many more moving parts. If you know what you’re doing, I guess! Or if it’s for business then it makes sense for some people to own premises in their super fund.

  10. Great interview Dave! I enjoy reading your blog. To be honest I thought Pete is a bit older :). Turns out he is exactly my age. What he achieved by this age is quite impressive and inspiring. Makes me want to push for FI harder. Thanks for a great interview. Looking forward to part 2.

  11. What a fantastic interview Dave!

    I had no idea about Peter but he seems to get high praise from a lot of people so I should check him out.

    I loved what he said about shares vs real estate being tribal, so true!

    I’m off to read part two now 😁

    1. Cheers Firebug!

      Definitely – Pete’s a top bloke and a well of knowledge! Enjoy Part Two 🙂

  12. Hi – Following FIRE movement and luv it. How did you know when to pull the trigger on work? When do you know if you have enough really as life throws curveballs all the time? I want to pull the trigger to FIRE but so scared I’m giving up a great job and income and scared I’ll be bored in a year etc. I don’t want to post for all to see so happy to personally email if needed, thanks heaps glad I found someone in Australia to FIRE as I follow Aussie Fire Bug too. Thanks

  13. Great chat with Pete, Dave, but I can’t help but think he didn’t really reflect the average Joe’s efforts to achieve FIRE. Two hefty wages from very early on in the piece would change any couple’s ability to do whatever they liked.

    I’d compare him to someone who’s just played 12 years of AFL or NRL. If you had those financial cards dealt to you you’d have to be pretty hopeless to not be set up for life. And that is clearly Pete and his wife’s circumstance. I mean he’s talking $3 mill with more than 10 houses around the world.

    Obviously they are a sharp pair of individuals and their earnings reflected that, which makes them different from footballers who are paid handsomely purely because they are good at footy, but an above excellent wage from mid 20s is a golden ticket.

    Good luck to Pete and I hope you don’t think I’m shooting Bambi, but I think the FIRE movement is populated by people who are aiming to knock off work early from more humble means and they’ll be sacrificing a hell of alot more to do so.

    1. Thanks Steve, I appreciate the comment. I see things a bit differently though.

      I think you’re right that Pete’s results certainly are not typical of the average Aussie – including his income on the road to FI. But to me, that doesn’t discount what he’s achieved. He would’ve been rubbing shoulders with some extremely high spenders and the peer pressure to follow that lifestyle would have been immense.

      The 10 houses thing has only come about since they’ve continued to earn money since reaching FI, allowing them to continue investing.

      Plenty of high income earners with nothing to show for it, just a pile of debt, so I don’t think we should discredit the achievement. Is it easier with a high income to save lots? Sure it is. Do people manage to do it? Nope, not very often. High income, middle income, low income, it all gets spent by most people. And to be fair, everyone’s situation is unique, so nobody’s journey needs to fit the ‘average’ person.

      My own story and 2 other early retirement stories I’ve featured so far, like this one, and this one, are perhaps more in line with an ‘average Joe’ story I suppose.

      No matter the income level, what matters at the end of the day is savings rate. And in Australia, the median salary is actually quite good so I don’t think there’s much sacrifice involved at all – just a different set of priorities.

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